Quote:
Chaim
Josephus and Tacitus, who were quoted earlier in this thread, show Jewish unanimity on God as they knew Him then, which is the same as today despite many different Jewish denominations. Jews today are unanimous in our belief that God is One absolute Unity.

Your best response is to claim that this very God who was "so intimately well known" already by Jews of
that day ensured well before Jesus that Jews would never go for a Trinity by commanding us in no uncertain terms never to worship gods our fathers didn't know or worship. Jews then and now do not believe a Trinity is a god our fathers ever knew and this is how we faithfully keep that commandment.

Do you believe God intentionally made it impossible for the faithful Jew to accept a Trinity? If not, how do you reconcile this better, or more full, understanding of God with the simple fact that worship of a Trinity is not anything like worship of an absolute unified God? You'd have to admit that worshipping
One vs. 3-in-1 is quite different. How can you expect Jews who are commanded clearly not to worship gods their fathers never knew to start worshipping something entirely different? Would you consider worshipping God as Mormons do? Maybe more was fully revealed to the Mormons. If not, why not? And
if not, how can you blame Jews?


Some remarks:
1. Because Christian faith has its foundation/roots in ancient Israel the Oneness of God (I repeat it) is not and can not be a matter of disagreement.

2. On an emotional level: I don't like to speak about God in terms of old greek philosophy: 'substance', 'person', 'hypostase', 'trinity' and that kind of words. It creates a conceptual system, which easily
becomes an ideology. I think you as a Jew has to look through the words, like 'trinity'. But I can imagine you as an orthodox Jew does not recognize a Trinity-God as the God of Abraham, Izac and Jacob. Christians, as far as I know do not worship the God called "Trinity". I don't pray and say to God:
"O god trinity".

3. Christianity has a special history: part of that history is the counter-missionary effort of the early christians against all kinds of heresies. They solved the problems with greek philosophical concepts. Christianity opened up the faith of Israel for the gentile nations (maybe in your eyes very wrong): the Torah was no hindrance anymore, gentiles did not have to become Jews through circumcision and keeping 613 commandments in order to be part of the spiritual Synagog/Church/Gathering of God; even the early Jewish believers in Jesus (orthodox like James) accepted this ruling. With this extension of faith gentile thought, mythology and religions became subject of countering and recycling/christianizing.

4. Compare these:

Jew A says: God, our Father said (to me).....
Jew B says: the Word of the Lord came to me.....
Jew C says: the Spirit of the LORD spoke (to me)......

These expressions are in complete harmony with the Jewish faith, they are as far as I can see not unjewish. All three say the same: in short: "God said (to me)".

Christian 1 : God, our Father said (to me).....
Christian 2 : the Word of the Lord came to me......
Christian 3 : the Spirit of the Lord said (to me)........

These expressions are in complete harmony with the christian faith. All three say the same: in short: "God said (to me)".

So what is the difference here between a Christian and a Jew. Can you point that out?

5. Melchizedek, king of Salem and priest of "the Most High God, possessor of heaven and earth" met Abram and he blessed Abram. In this meeting Abram and Melchizedek recognized each other's God as the same God: the God of Abram (the LORD) is the same as the God of Melchizedek 'the most high God' (see Ge. 14 esp. verse 22).

6. Gen. 18
Abraham experiences a theophany: God reveals Himself to Abraham. In this event Abraham sees three men. "And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo,......". Abraham lifted up his eyes, he looked and 'lo': that is Abraham looked or watched three times. The looking of Abraham is described very extensive and what did he see? Three men. Why would God reveal Himself by the representation of three men? This must have a special meaning. Do you know why?

Aad