ForgotPassword?
Sign Up
Search this Topic:
Forum Jump
Posts: 20703
Wed, 18-Jun-08 08:18:02
Moderator
Lady Felix wrote: I believe you are miss understanding Mathew 23. I just read it myself and Jsus was rebuking the unrighteous pharisees not the righteous pharisees. Jesus was addressing the Pharisees not the Jewish people. He was rebuking the Pharisees for being hypocrites not practicing what they preached. . . . For a man that you believe never existed you really do hate him. . .How can you hate Jsus if you do not believe in Him? That would be like me hating Santa Claus when I do not believe in him.
LF, Matthew 23 and Luke 11 are very clear. They are full of hatred. They both blame Jews for EVERY murder from Abel forward! You don't see the hatred in this? Really???
Matthew 23:31 "So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 "Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers. 33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell? 35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.
Whoever wrote this (putting the words in Jsus' mouth) were setting up a terrible prejudice against all Jews. Just think, LF, a newborn Jewish baby is guilty of the blood of Abel! How crazy is that? How full of hatred??
FYI the Pharisees ARE the Jews -- the Jews of today. We are Torah observing Jews. It is the GT that has Jsus say that he comes not to bring mercy, but death. The Pharisees taught JUST THE OPPOSITE. As others have pointed out in this thread, your opinion of the Pharisees is distorted by the GT. Here are a few other quotes. First from the "loving" Jsus:
Quote: Matthew 23:33), You snakes, you generation of vipers, how can you escape the damnation of hell? John 3:36), He who believes in the Son has everlasting life. But he who does not believe in the Son shall not see life, but shall suffer the everlasting wrath of G-d.
Quote: (Tosefta, Sanhedrin 13), The righteous of all nations have a share in the World to Come.
Lady Felix wrote: I believe you are miss understanding Mathew 23. I just read it myself and Jsus was rebuking the unrighteous pharisees not the righteous pharisees.
This is certainly what the Xians believe and what the GT says. But words are just words. In actuality it is Jsus (as portrayed in the GT) who is hypocritical, not the Pharisees he accuses. The Pharisees ARE the Jews, LF. The Torah observant Jews who chastise Jsus for not only his failure to keep Torah, but his actual encouragement of others away from G-d's word.
Quote: Be deliberate in Judgement (Mishnah, Avot 1:1): Judges must take care that even if they have judged similar cases two or three times before, they must take care in deliberating before issuing a ruling. ("Justice, Justice, shall you pursue" Deut. 16:20) The world stands on three things on the Torah, on the service [of G-d], and upon acts of loving-kindness. (Mishnah, Avot 1:2) How to be a servant of G-d Antigonus...used to say "Be not as servants who serve the master [ie G-d] for the sake of receiving [even a token] reward, but rather, be like servants who serve the master not for the sake of receiving reward; and [nonetheless] the fear [or awe] of Heaven should be upon you." (Mishnah, Avot 1:3) What does this mean? It does not mean that we will not be rewarded ever (Zaddok and and Boethus mistakenly thought this, and started two new sects, rejecting the Oral Law. Zaddok founded the Sadducees, and Boethus founded Boethusim). I means that we should do G-d's will because it is G-d's will, and not for the sake of reward. Treatment of the poor Yose ben Yochanan...say: "Let your house be open wide [ie for guests, hopitality, anyone in need]; treat the poor as members of your household..." (Mishnah, Avot 1:5) Judge everyone favorably This was said by Yehoshua ben Perachyah in Mishnah, Avot 1:6. It means that we should not jump to conclusions, but think the best of a person about whom we do not know all the facts. If something looks as if a person is doing something bad, we must assume that there is something we do not yet know, and find out the facts. Hillel says: "Be among the disciples of Aaron, loving peace and pursuing peace, loving people and bringing them closer to the Torah" (Mishnah, Avot 1:12) Hillel may have still been alive when Jesus was born, since he lived in the time of Herod "the Great"
Quote: Of splinters and beams Rabbi Yochanan, quoting a saying from the judges (the same judges the book of Judges talks about), said (after the destruction of the Second Temple) "If [a judge] would say to [a defendant], 'Remover the splinter from between your teeth (ie refrain from a minor infraction),' [the defendent] would retort to [the judge], 'Remove the beam from before your eyes [ie refrain from a major transgression]'" (Talmud, Bava Batra 15b3, Art Scroll translation)
Share This