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"Love your neighbour as yourself" and "Love your enemies" alone are enough for any true follower of Jesus NOT to commit any of those atrocities against the Jews just as "Do not touch My anointed ones, and do not harm My prophets"(1CH.16:22 JPT) should have been enough to make anyone (who fear God) treat any prophet like an eggshell.
Therefore there's no guarantee any of the phrases proposed for Jesus would have worked.




BUT ATROCITIES STILL HAPPENED AND DID HAPPEN IN THE NAME OF JEESUS. And where did they acquire their origin and nay, sanction -- I think you failed to read the Gospel of John, his letters and his "Revelation". Loving your enemies is NO where on those pages. If Jeesus were really a prophet, and "taught" Torah, then this Jewish 'prophet" would have seen that his most 'beloved" disciple was spewing the most venomous, most diabolical diatribes against the Jews. John even attributes these words TO Jeesus, which automatically removes the slightest possibility of him being a prophet in the JEWISH sense. I think that's what the crux is. If xians want to believe (as muslims do, ironically) that Jeesus as a prophet, fine.. believe it. But I do think there needs to be a distinction between what a JEWISH prophet is (which prophesy ceased with the last of the Jewish Prophets, Malachi) and a pagan clairvoyant.

In any event, I don't think that Jeesus was a prophet because he never wrote anything. Even Paul and Muhammed, despite their claim of being a prophet, wrote their own works. However, as I've said before, anyone can be a "prophet" AFTER the fact. I can take out a piece of paper, date it for September 11, 1999 and predict that America will be attacked from the air by muslim extremists. It doesn't make me a prophet. Likewise, the events that Jeesus "prophesied" were written AFTER the fact (as most of the accounts of Jeeesus). If the writers couldn't even get the history correct of how the Jewish sanhedrin worked and what did and did not constitute their jurisdiction, why should we trust Jeesus' "Prophetic" ability? In addition, if one of xianity's main "teachers", Paul, outright lied about his pedigree and his education (he was NEVER a student of Rabbi Gamilel I, nor was he ever a pharisee since he worked as a temple guard for the SADDUCEES in league with Rome), truthfully, how reliable are the characters in this "unfolding of god's plan"?


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The fact that Jesus did not use any of the proposed phrases or even outrightly prevent those atrocities if He could (Christians believe He can) is consistent with Hashem's behaviour. Hashem sometimes allow evil to happen for reasons we mortals don't FULLY know. However the worst that could happen to anyone is DEATH (Human POV) but to Hashem they merely went to SLEEP -He will WAKE His own to glory in the ressurection (Dan.12:2). No amount of pain God's people may suffer now (TEMPORARY) is comparable to that coming (ETERNAL) glory (Hashem's POV).



First of all, let's cut the nonsense and blasphemous rhetoric. Jeesus is NOT HaShem.. so let's just clear this idolatrous notion here and now. G-d is neither a wanton prejudiced, lying, malicious, slandering, evil, putrid, ill-tempered envious wanna be sage. Nor do G-d's Angels have the names of such "luminaries" as Paul, Chystonsom, Augstine, Justinian and Luther, nor are the names of the "Archangels" Thomas de Torquemada and Adolph Hitler.

And while we're on this clarification, the millions of Jews that were butchered, hacked to bits, burned alive in locked halls or synagogues, tortured, brutalized, raped, pillaged, exiled, forcibly converted, victims of libels and pogroms and eventually exterminated in en mass were done in the name of JEESUS, NOT HaShem (dear G-d, how on earth could you say such a thing!). These perpetrators were people who truly were xian (even the Nazis felt they were ridding the Jews for bringing as Hitler put it, "the scourge of conscience" upon the world. He echoed the sentiments of the Church as well as Luther!). You can't hair split at this point and project YOUR criteria of what a xian is back on those who saw themselves as more devout than you may be. Now to be fair, Popes and bishops did try to intervene to prevent such pogroms, but this was NOT out of their love of the Jews as much as it would be the economic loss they would experience at the Jews' death.

And while we're on this topic: The victims of these atrocities were/are not "sleeping".. they were gassed, burned, butchered; ONE MILLION children alone were exterminated in some of the most gruesome ways. Nor are the victims of the terrorism via the Palestinians. One pregnant woman and her three daughters had TWO, count them, TWO cartridges of bullets put into them by Palestinian terrorists to the point when recovery volunteers came, there was hardly anything left of the bodies of those poor souls! And you say this was done in the name of HaShem and that they are merely sleeping?????????? Were they "put down" like animals or even a favorite pet??? Is that what you're saying??? That G-d is simply smiling and saying "nite nite, here's a blankie and a lulliby"??


This nonsense of "temporary pain" vs. "eternal glory ala the resurrection" is a moral cop out and a polemic free pass to butcher even more in the name of god and yet have clean hands and a pristine conscience! It's abysmally self-righteous and makes Adolph Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Yassir Arafat, Thomas deTorquemada, Pablo Christiani, John Chrystomson, and every militant Islamic and Palestinian terrorist an "angel of G-d"; and absolves them of any responsibility for the wanton blood lust and violence done not only against Jews but against anyone who dare challenges the muderers version of what they consider "truth". It elevates the murderers to "Servants of G-d" and relegates the poor victims to "animal" status to be put down and "put to sleep" because of some "bad deed".

But it also creates an even more sinister condundrum. As a result, we cannot say then that this god of yours is a righteous god who is going to judge the living and the dead for their actions. He has no moral or righteous means to do so because these murderers cannot truthfully be judged for exterminating them. They merely "put them to sleep" like a dog or an animal and truly cannot be held responsible for murder because in god's eyes, as YOU say, he merely viewed them as "sleeping". So there cannot be any judgement on MURDER. And if there cannot be true justice from your god on this matter, then it's safe to then conclude, not merely assume, that all other sins are subject to the same revisionist consideration. "it's not really elder abuse, it's preparing them for the next world and to leave this plane to be with the almighty". "It's not really adultery, it's just sampling the fruit off another buffet just to see what it's like because after all, in Heaven there is no marriage, no male nor female, Jew or xian.. and the Law has been replaced by Grace". "It's not really stealing.. it's simply borrowing an advance on future blessings from god". In short, it's a cop out and for you to even suggest such a thing is indictative of some kind of moral revisionism of history and abdication of responsibility! So then no one (EXCEPT the Jews and other "nonbelievers" of course! ) can truly be held accountable for any action that they may or may not do.

In addition, this cop out about "Satan" (aka the Devil) ruling this world is also a blow to the authority as well as to the validity of your jeesus. Your own NT states that jeeus is at the right hand of the "father" and all power and dominion WAS, (not WILL, WAS) given to him. It also says that he destroyed (again past tense) the works of the Enemy (Satan). IF this is true, then how on earth if he has this dominion can there be a renegade "angel" running free range on earth wrecking havoc in Jeesus' name? Either your jeesus has power or he doesn't. If he does, then he could have prevented and nay thwarted the atrocities done in his "sacred" name, which again would underscore his malicious nature and personality. It also underscores that he actually advocated the mass production of Extermination of entire peoples (starting first with the Jews and then going into the New World to take care of the "heathen" Native Americans). If he is truly god or god's son or whatever and was given daddy's power, this shouldn't be a hard thing to stop and thwart. I mean, he's king of the universe. It should be a relatively simple thing to do since, according to Matthew, he even challenged Pilate's authority. So dealing with his true followers (his "allies") in the Church who rule via proxy for him, should not have been a difficult matter since all he had to do is step into the institutions and the offices that were created to rule for him. He didn't even need to summon an army. They were all waiting for him. It would have been so easy.

IF he doesn't yet have full authority over a small planet called Earth, then why believe his name and authority is the name above all names and that he has authority over heaven and earth? If Satan can truly be the "god of this world" (which is an absurdity because G-d himself then would have lied when He announced "there is no other god or savior but Me".) then jeesus and HIS CHURCH has no authority here and he has no power to judge anyone (either individually or during the supposed "millenium kingdom" when he's supposed to rule for 1000 years and judge mankind) since he truthfully has no jurisdiction and/or authority here. So either he is god and he has control over the universe including the supposed "dominion" of Satan OR he does not and therefore cannot judge anyone in the dominion of another god, since YOU made the claim that Satan is the god of this world. King A can't judge the residents/subjects of King B by King A's laws because King A does NOT have authority over King B's kingdom! The only way this can happen is if King A subdued King B but allowed King B to be a lesser power.. but this isn't what you're stating. As such Jeeeus has no power of Satan if Satan rules. This is the absurdity of what you're wanting us to believe.

In addition, let's get clear on something else. G-d never punished the Jewish people continually for more than 2000 years. The most G-d punished the Jewish People was for 70 years and although G-d may have allowed the Galut (Exile) to continue for at least 2000 years, G-d never used wholescale extermination of the People to prove a point. In fact, in response to the atrocities done during the Babylonian exile, G-d became extremely angry when the nations went overboard. However, during this whole time, the Jewish people had prophets that more or less filtered those horrific experiences of the Exile to Babylon through the prism of G-d's reasoning as well as His reassurance of Return. We no longer have the benefit of that prism as we don't have prophets. We do have sages and we do have the ability to look back so to speak draw some parallels to understand somewhat the purpose of this suffering. But THIS conjucture on your part is well, downright fabrication and places G-d as a butcher and places the most heinous of the despots as his servants. Something that I find highly repulsive.

In addition, what sin, what offense, what possible "mistake" could the Jews or any people for that matter have committed that would justify the extermination of them en mass for over 2000 years? Post Shoah, we don't even make the Germans eternally accountable for the most evil crime ever inflicted on humanity. In fact, other nations are now copying what the Nazis did and are killing people en mass and the world, now as then, stands by and does nothing. Only when the truth is finally revealed, then we'll see some knee jerk reaction. The point is, only the Jews and now other minorities have always been targeted and maligned and butchered in the name of god.. be it christ or allah. This deflection on your part absolves any true wrong doing but at the same time, you say G-d will judge the gentiles.. how can He if the standard is compromised?? He would not have the authority nor the right to do so.

The Jewish opinion on this is much more complicated but at the same time, pretty straight forward. According to what I have read and studied (and the moderators can correct me and elucidate if I really didn't "get it"), that while we DON"T know why G-d allows such horrible, horrible things to happen at the hands of the godless, nevertheless He did promise that Israel would always remain: remain few in number AND remain as an eternal entity. He also promised that they would return to the Land and in the end, they will NEVER again be the victims. In fact, they will teach the nations of the world the knowledge of G-d and Torah. Until that happens, we wrestle with the why's, how's and "for what reason"'s. We are to hold fast to G-d and His Mitzvot. G-d WILL Judge all the nations and will judge the murderers, idolators and those who tried to destroy the Jews and made victims of others (like in Sudan) who could not defend themselves. And He will judge those of us who did nothing or very little and will reward all those who followed the command "Love Mercy do Justice and walk circumspectly with your G-d". But to simply do a moral cop out like you proposed is certainly NOT one of them.

OUR (even though I'm in the process of converting, I still have to make a distinction) G-d is not a wanton exterminator, neither is He a lax judge. He is King of the Universe, Whose Dominion also includes this blue gem third from the sun.. a place where there has never truly been any peace. However, one day He will directly rule His people. And on that day, true Justice and Peace shall prevail.