All: I feel I have to comment on this.. Please forgive my somewhat verbose post!

It may help to realize that the Presence of G-d and Moses' gift/level of prophecy mentioned in the Torah have NOTHING at all to do with the xian version of the "holy spirit" and visa versa (and they never will). The xian "holy spirit" has no place/comparable element within Judaism/Torah and even with its G-d; this no matter how many xians may take umbrage at this and vehemently insist otherwise. The experiences xians claim to have personally experienced or been witness to also has absolutely no place within Judaism; including this so-called "baptism in holy spirit" (do a search as to what this really is.... it's not a "baptism" at all).

And not to be rude and crude, but so what if a certain person had a "baptism in the holy spirit"... so did I when I was 13--the whole kit and kaboodle with tongues, visions, etc., etc., etc.. blah blah blah... BUT does that have anything to do with Judaism and with the G-d of the Torah.. absolutely, undeniably, unequivocally NOT. Does it change what Torah told the JEWISH people what they should accept and reject? It cannot and never will. If a xian wants to believe in this "baptism in holy spirit" concept and they use that as the means to make a change for the better in their lives, that's one thing and that is fine. But to try to sell it to Jews under the guise that it's a continuation of the experiences of Moses (G-d forbid) or have them accept the axiom that if it's mystical then it must be true? That is really a violation of what G-d SAID to Moses and the Jewish People at Sinai. G-d was very clear on this issue. The mystical can never trump what the nation had seen and heard from G-d Himself. Besides, to give any creed or validation to this as it relates to Judaism or the Tanakh IS a violation of the Torah's injunctions and a total disregard to what the prophets stated since true prophecy ended with the Great Assembly several hundred years before the Common Era.

And so what if a person has a "mystical" experience? EVERY religion trumps a mystical element. So why should we give credence to the "mystical machinations" of one religion (Xtianity) and ignore all the other claims of miracles and such by adherents of other religions, whose testimony is just as 'true' as those from Xianity? But more importantly, why should we be forced to blindly and unquestionably accept the claims of these Trinitarians (since the holy spirit is part of the Triune godhead of Xtianity) when such claims violate everything that was revealed in the Torah? Why should we accept any claim as to validity of these experiences when the Torah warned us some 3500 years ago that there would ALWAYS be people who would claim miracles and wonders and because of them "prove" that they correct and the Jews are not? The Torah even warned us about the emergence of Xianity and Islam! So should we accept any of claims made by thousands of xians or muslims or whatnot simply because someone has a "mystical" experience, or claims they were Jewish and "found the lord", or that they "allegedly" share our Bible so we must accept their claims as they allegedly worship the same god as we do? To follow this line of questioning to a more pointed conclusion---are we supposed to believe that xians undeniably and without question, believe EVERY claim that is produced by EVERY person allegedly "baptized" in the "holy spirit"?

Or more to the point: is the REAL reason for not questioning any validity regarding a baptism in the holy spirit is because pentecostal/evangelical xians are told NOT to question anything that smacks of the "holy spirit" for fear of "sinning" against the holy spirit; since according to the NT that is one transgression from which there is no "forgiveness" (so much for their god's "sacrifice" atoning for ALL sins)? Is there this fear that questioning the validity of the "baptism" akin to "blaspheming" the holy spirit (which means ascribing the "work" of the holy spirit to those of man or worse.. the "devil") and therefore to avoid that sentence, they avoid doing any sort of research on the topic??

This was the major hurdles I had to overcome in my path to Judaism. But once I found out the scientific and sociological/psychological explanation of this so-called "baptism in the holy spirit" really is (and EVERY culture has a variant of this... it's simply the mystical element), I quickly came to the conclusion that there was nothing really mystical about it and I didn't have to fear any type of "wrath of god" or "unforgiveness" on his part. Additionally, I have come to see that it's really one's own assimilation of their indoctrination. in short, THEY make the experience but use this "baptism in the holy spirit" to hide behind in order to avoid any scrutiny or investigation; after all, what xian really wants to be accused of "blaspheming the holy spirit"? Furthermore, the unspoken side issue of it is that it is being reinforced by the like group (pentecostals, evangelicals, baptists, etc.); mudding the waters even more; affording older members the luxury of being seen as having more "discernment". The group reinforces the mystique and "untouchable" aspect of the phenomenon.

Once the "mystique" is removed, we can see it for what it really is---good AND bad. Which makes the Words of the Torah all the more sweeter and all the more poignant.. and our love for G-d Himself even deeper in that He warned us of these things many, many centuries before. EACH generation of Jews had to deal with other people/religions claiming they had the truth and had "experiences" from G-d... be it the Midianites, the Egyptians, the Canaanites, the Assyrians, the Babylonians, the Persians, the Greeks, the Romans, the Xians, the Muslims, and now the pentecostals and messy-antics. Devarim 4 tells us of our own experience with G-d Himself. We don't need any other "personal claims". Our ancestors received the real thing at Sinai and every year we are reminded of that. So am I confident that this "baptism of the holy spirit" is NOT from the same G-d I serve? ABSOLUTELY.