Quote:
According to the nt, after the crucifixion the disciples were dejected. Peter had denied that he had even known Jesus at his trial. After the resurrection though when they met the risen Jesus, the apostles were so happy, changed and dedicated their lives toward the spreading of the gospel under terrible circumstances and most died as martyrs.

Of course there are martyrs in other religions... islam, buddhism etc. But those convictions were based upon indoctrination i.e brainwashing, while the apostles ALL were changed by the direct risen Jesus - in person, not a teaching or philosophy. How could have that been a lie that they ALL were changed, that they became super evangelizes that all should believe in Jesus?


dougg, this remains a very weak argument. first of all your greek book only mentions TWO followers of the xian god that were supposedly killed. that is james and stephen. and it does not say that they died for a belief in your risen god. there were others that supposedly saw your risen god, however, there is no historical information as to who they were moreless how they died.

for your arguement to have any foundation you would need to prove historically that those who supposedly saw your risen god WILLINGLY died for this belief and for no other reason. meaning they were given the chance to recant their beliefs and made a choice to die for their belief. there is nothing written in your book or historically that supports that this was the case. no where does it say that they were given an opportunity to avoid death by recanting their beliefs.

so did xians die because of their belief in a risen xian god? not according to history. there was no systematic persecution of xians until the second half of the second century. and those persecutions were mainly political verses a belief in a risen xian god. even the supposed death of xians during the reign of nero was not because of a belief in a risen xian god but because nero needed someone to blame his crime of burning rome on.

xians put themselves outside THE LAW by refusing to see emperors as divine. so if they were killed it was not because of a belief in a risen xian god. the belief in a risen god/gods was the norm of that time. was widely accepted. so xians were not killed for a belief in a risen god but for their rejection of the divinity of the emperors.

so your statement that the apostles were "changed by the direct risen j-zuz" has nothing to do with the reason xians were persecuted or even killed. for your statements to have any foundation, you must prove that any xian who has ever been killed was given a CHOICE to recant their belief in a risen xian god and that they died for no other reason.